The Breast of Everything

Sue Glader on "I have breast cancer … and a toddler”

May 06, 2021 Comprehensive Breast Care
The Breast of Everything
Sue Glader on "I have breast cancer … and a toddler”
Show Notes Transcript

Who would ever think that a young mother with a toddler would have to deal with breast cancer? It happened to Sue Glader, a 33-year-old wife, mother of a 13-month-old son, and freelance copywriter.  She survived in stride with every step of her cancer – from diagnosis, to surgery, chemotherapy and radiation – and it only made her more determined and stronger. She became a breast cancer survivor with a mission – to help other women who would “walk in my shoes.” 

In hopes of educating herself on what to expect during her cancer journey, Sue read many books and articles only to feel terrified and traumatized from the content. She decided to use her talents as a writer and her experience as a breast cancer survivor to publish a story that was realistic but not frightening. Her article turned into “Nowhere Hair,” a children’s book that uses a hip and beautiful bald mama to explain cancer of a loved one to children. 

The little girl in the book knows her mom’s hair is not on her head anymore so it must be somewhere. After searching all around the house for it, she learns her mother is undergoing cancer treatment, but she still is the same silly, attentive, happy mom; just very tired and sometimes cranky. In the book, Sue explains hats, scarves, wigs, baldness in public, and why it is important to be nice to people who may look a little different. What is inside of us is far more important than how we look on the outside. Being bald is a time to be brave, bold and beautiful.

When talking with your children about your illness, be honest but reassuring, Sue suggests. Have age-appropriate conversations. Get into the mind of a child. Since her son was so young when she learned of her diagnosis, Sue was most worried about how he would react to her baldness so she took him with her to the barber to watch her head getting shaved. 

Kids are not judgmental, they are curious. Take them along for the ride – physically and emotionally. Reassure them they cannot catch cancer, and neither can Dad. Relieve them of their worries. You can tell them your hair is falling out because the medicine is working. Let them know you are still there for them. You may not be able to drive them to soccer practice, but you will be home waiting for them. 

Talk with your kids, but do it in small bits, not the “let’s sit down and talk” conversation. That will scare any child. Make them part of the journey. If the family is together, mom will not feel so alone.

If readers can take away one message from her book, it is this, Sue points out: treat people kindly, treat them the way you want to be treated. You still are an amazing, creative, powerful woman but with no hair! 

And take the time to talk with other women who have walked in your shoes to gain perspective.

Unknown Speaker  0:01  
Welcome to the breast of everything podcast your trusted resource for breast health information support and encouragement. Your host today is Dr. Lindsay gold of comprehensive breast care. Welcome.

Unknown Speaker  0:13  
Hello, and welcome to the breast of everything podcast. I'm your host today Dr. Lindsay gold of comprehensive breast care. I have a wonderful guest today. It is Sue glitter author of the book nowhere hair. Sue glitter is a freelance copywriter for companies such as Levi Strauss, HP, General Electric, Marriott, hotels, and the economist. But that's not why she's here today. A breast cancer diagnosis at age 33, with a 13 month old toddler at home opened up a whole new world to her traumatized by the kind of materials provided to explain cancer to patients and their children. Sue decided she'd be the change she wanted to see in the world. The result is nowhere hair, a children's book that uses a hip and beautiful bald mama to explain cancer to a loved one to young children. Today, there are more than 25,000 copies of the book in circulation. And it is used by more than 100 Cancer Centers world wide. So it's such a pleasure to have you on our podcast to talk about your book. Thank you so much for joining us.

Unknown Speaker  1:26  
I am thrilled to be here and really honored to share my story about this.

Unknown Speaker  1:33  
I hope all of our guests listening today, go on Amazon or wherever you get your books and look up nowhere here. I love this book. And it's a quick, wonderful read, you can probably read it as an adult while you know going to the bathroom. But I have to tell you do it in private because it brought tears to my eyes, like actual tears with a cleaner. So it was so so beautiful. So beautiful. Tell me, tell me how it came about for you?

Unknown Speaker  2:07  
Well, I had I was diagnosed as you said, as a, you know, young mother and and it was really the last thing that I thought I was going to have to be dealing with when I was dealing with a toddler in tow. And I am a writer by trade. And when I got you know, the short story is that when I got to the other side of this, through the the treatment and whatnot, and I had seen these books and many pamphlets and things that were put out by some of the larger nonprofit organizations that I will not name, they were just, they were just terrifying. That's just the best word that I can possibly say that they were often illustrated by children, which is a great and noble idea. But in the actual actual time when you see them, you know, a child is going to make her mother green and look really freakish. And that's not helpful for the mother that then has to read something over and over again, because we all know, children don't read a book once they want to read it 47 times. So I just really felt like once once I got through the whole treatment, which was you know, which was sarebbero a year radiation and chemotherapy and the whole nine. And I said, You know, I really want to pay this forward, somehow I want to help women that are going to be walking in my shoes, and I feel like this is a niche that I can I am uniquely in a position to fill. And so that's when I was like, Okay, I think I'm going to write a book, I always thought I'd read a book, I really never thought it was gonna be on this particular topic, but then that's left for you, you know? Well, it

Unknown Speaker  3:58  
is it is just fantastic. And you're absolutely right, it is very necessary. You know, as, as the surgeon seeing women of all ages, yes. I am frequently asked, What do I tell my children and you know, if you can remember back, I mean, there is so much in the beginning to go through and deal with that as the surgeon, I mean, I don't have a ton of time to go through all the psychology of it. But in short, I try and tell ladies that you know, the literature that the psychology literature supports. I'm being honest, but not in a frightening way. Right? Be honest but reassuring. Right? So to me, that's exactly what your what your book did. How did you explain it to your son?

Unknown Speaker  4:54  
Well, you know, he was actually blessedly too little to really have Have a conversation he was you know, 13 months old. So we were working on, you know, going from crawling to walking and right and other such stuff. So I kind of got on easy and that what I tried to do with him was when I had to when my hair started falling out in clumps, and it was like, Oh, boy, this is here we go. We went down to the local Barber, and I brought him with me and my husband. And it was like, I want you to witness what's happening here. I don't want to just show up, you know, leave the house when one minute and come back the next and be a completely different human being. And so I, you know, he watched when it happened. And then I went over to him and, you know, in the motherly way we do, it's like, Where's volunteer? Right, you know, he put his little hands on there. And he grabbed my head. And he kind of smiled and giggled, and it was like, okay, we're launched like, this is it's breaking my heart right now to have to do this. But we're doing this together. And we're doing this as a family. And so that, you know, that was really my experience with him. Being a mom, and going to the park, as moms do, and seeing a lot of other kids look at me with my bald head because I was, you know, I was young, and I was proud. And I was like, I'm bald, for you with that. And, and, you know, not a lot of kids would actually know, kids came up to me and talk to her about it. So,

Unknown Speaker  6:30  
I mean, kids don't really care. They're just curious at best. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker  6:34  
Yeah, they, they're pretty good about sort of accepting what is they may say something inappropriate in a store. You know, they might overhear, for example. But they, you know, most and if they and if they are curious, they will come right up to you and be like, you know, what's going on with with what's going on with you? Why don't you have any hair?

Unknown Speaker  6:55  
Right, but there's no judgment associated with that. And what I hear from a lot of ladies is, you know, the looks they get from people, which are, are they interpret, I should say, it's sort of pity, right? Yeah. And that's not really what people need it. Yes, people need to be treated. Just, you know, just like cars, like you would treat anybody kind any day of the week.

Unknown Speaker  7:23  
Yeah, yeah. The you know, it's funny that the book, obviously, it's, it's focused on sort of the nitty gritty of what goes on when you lose your hair, and the things that are sort of the high level things that are going on the outward signs of what's going on when you're dealing with chemotherapy, and a small child at home. But the end of the book really hits home on some messages that are, you know, they're universal, it's like, treat someone else as you would like to be treated, right? Don't stare at snicker Don't, don't be cruel, be kind. And truly, it's what's going on inside the BOD. Like what's inside of us how cool we are as people. And it's not these outward things, because you know, what, this too will change your hair will grow back. It is it is a you know, it is a period of time that you're going going through. And, you know, Lord knows, we all need to remember that it's what's what's inside the council, I was really kind of happy to end and the book on that moral moralistic point, you know,

Unknown Speaker  8:27  
absolutely. And, you know, I don't want to give it away for all of our listeners, but I think getting a little bit into the mind of a child who, you know, thinks something might be their fault. Or thinks it you know, your situation might be as a result of, you know, something date they did, I mean, I happen to be divorced. And, you know, that was a big deal going through a divorce. Right? You know, this isn't your fault. This isn't because, but you know, you think with a cancer diagnosis, children may assume those same kind of things

Unknown Speaker  9:02  
and 100% 100%. And it's, that's where part of the, the importance of really being honest and taking your child along for the ride, not, you know, sometimes physically, but also just emotionally and socially, that it's like, yeah, they're going to think some things that you may say to yourself, that's ridiculous, but it lives in their mind. So, yes, you know, I've been fighting with my sister, and that got mom, right. And this is what happened, or, you know, even more tricky. Especially, it's funny, you know, I wrote this book a decade ago, but that, that it's not something you can catch, right? Yeah. You talk about how you know, we all talk about, you know, the swine flu, and washing your hands and all that kind of stuff. But now we've got COVID and so there is a real need to say, you're not going to catch this and I'm not going to give it to dad. Right? Cuz I think there are a lot of younger kids that worry Oh my god, what happens if something happens to dad to like, I'm worried about mom, but now I'm worried about my, you know, my nuclear family growing up. So it's really important to to make those points and sometimes make them multiple times. You know, it's not something you did you can't you can't get this I'm not going to give to anybody else.

Unknown Speaker  10:25  
Yep, such good points that adults generally, I think wouldn't consider on assets, you know, right out there. So, tell me a little bit about your Illustrator. Because the pictures are great. I love them.

Unknown Speaker  10:39  
Ada is she is amazing. I picked her because I saw her. Well, she starts she's, she lives in Holland. And her women that she draws are strong. And they've got a swagger a and her style is is watercolor. And it really, I just wanted something that had the right amount of sauciness and whimsy to elevate what is, as we all know, just a horrific thing to have to talk about. So I wanted to balance out content that would, as you mentioned, you know, have a tendency to maybe make you a little weepy with something that was going to say, you know, to the person that was reading it, both the big, the big, the big person and the little person, hey, you know, this is all going to be okay. And you still are that same amazing, powerful, wonderful, creative, healthy human. You just don't happen to have hair at the moment. Yeah, and it is absolutely captured that 100% so you're dead. These are things that kids enjoy looking at. And and I do too, every time I open this book, and I look at it, I think

Unknown Speaker  12:02  
oh man, hit it out of the park with her I do and whimsical is probably one of the words I would use to describe it. It's so it's just adorable. So did you really have a hat for every mood?

Unknown Speaker  12:14  
I you know, I did not have a hat for every mood. I wish I did. But she's got this great illustrations. Picture of like, the will datas background is fashion. illustration. So she so when I when she read that line, she's like, Oh, I'm going to have a good time here. I'm going to make all kinds of crazy hats. But no, I am. I'm more on the functional end of the spectrum. I had a really, really good cashmere knit cap. Oh, no, I just wore everywhere, including to bed. So I didn't quite realize how cold the bed is. And when one does not have hair, it's shockingly cold the bedroom.

Unknown Speaker  12:57  
It Yep, one of those things that you probably just don't realize until you have to go through it. So, um, what what types of questions do you think moms should be prepared for or even dads to answer from their kids about the process, or being diagnosed?

Unknown Speaker  13:16  
Well, you know, it's, um, I say that I don't have any of the alphabet letters after my name, like, you know, PhD or licensed social worker, any of that kind of stuff I'm not, I'm someone that gets experience from having gone through it. And then you know, studied, obviously studied the, the existing literature and all that, but it seems that it really depends on the age of your kid. I mean, I've had people tell me, they, you know, read this to their two and a half year old, which seems really, really young. And then I've had people you know, the, the age ranges, you know, somewhere two and a half to like six or seven. But, you know, if you've got some child that's on the lower end of the spectrum, it you know, the the idea of, you know, my hair is gone, but it's going to come back and the fact that my hair is gone is a good thing, because that means that the medicine that I'm taking is, is moving. So you make a kind of a cause and effect of something that is really scary and looks really wrong. But actually, it's part of what's helping. I think that's something that littler people can understand. You know, older kids are really wanting to know that their life is not going to be completely up ended because mom who is supposed to be doing all that in the bag of chips at all times. is not going to quite be able to juggle as much because she's going to be going to appointments and doing surgery and just resting. recuperating. What a concept for for a mother if that doesn't happen. Yeah, Lee so so making sure that you know, older kids. Get that you know Still here for you, I may not be able to drive you to your soccer practice. Or, you know, we may need to have some other people help us out. But I am still here for you. I think that's an often thing that and sometimes I think that comes out as a bit of snarkiness. By the older kids, they get a little annoyed with the whole thing. Yep. And that's really hard for moms and dads to, you know, deal with. But that's that's a reality. It's that time kids process.

Unknown Speaker  15:33  
Yeah, it like you say, children of various ages. I mean, there's a point in time where teenagers are what my own therapist says developmentally narcissistic. They're supposed to be that way. But it's very frustrating. It's frustrating when you just have them in your well, and they never consider anybody else. But when you're, you know, going through a lot, it's very difficult. Yes, I've heard over and over when this so self centered, for lack of a better explanation.

Unknown Speaker  16:05  
Yes, absolutely.

Unknown Speaker  16:07  
Yeah. So although this book is, of course, not about death and dying, and your wonderful picture of health here this many years later, children, maybe not little ones. I mean, they may ask about Yes. You know, the quote, are you going to die? That's, that's, that's difficult for any age.

Unknown Speaker  16:31  
Yeah. And, you know, there's one of the things I try to tell people, it no matter how old their child is, is, if you're going to have, you need to talk to your kids. That is my position is also the position of any, you know, clinical social worker in this in this field, is, you know, try to do it in smaller bits, you know, sitting down with the, oh, we need to have a talk conversation. is terrifying for them. It actually literally, I just got chills just actually saying that phrase out loud, because it's, it's such a loaded awful phraseology, and like, we're going to talk about something that's really hard right now. So to to do something in smaller bits is, is better. And, and that is especially appropriate, I think, for conversations about the big question of, you know, what does this mean, for me? Are you going to die? And I think that, you know, obviously, we don't know what we don't, we can't, we can't figure out what the future holds. But they're, and this is so much truer today than it was 20 years ago, when I went through this is that many, many, many people have this disease and get better. And most Actually, yeah, right. And that, you know, I'm working with my doctor, and my doctor is giving me medicine, that's going to make me better. And, you know, and for the little bit of older kids, as you know, I'm going to tell you how this is going, I'm going to keep you apprised, of course, you would never use that word, but you know, I'm going to tell it, I'm going to tell you what's going on. And I'm you know, you're going to be part of this journey with me and kind of leave open, you know, the what if, because we, you know, we can't possibly know, but the idea is that you're, you're telling them that they're not going to be alone with their thoughts that you were doing this together as a family, and they are as important as it is for them to feel like they are with you. It's equally as important for you to feel that they are them for you. They are there with you for Yes, because as a parent, you know, that is our job is to keep our kids safe and help them grow up. And this is one of the biggest lessons you can ever learn is that Oh baby, sometimes things get tricky and hard. And you got to just dig in and have faith and do the work and do it together. And I think that is a fantastic, positive thing that comes out of something that is very, very hard, and very scary.

Unknown Speaker  19:21  
That's an excellent point that we are we're doing this together because what I hear a lot from ladies, even who have supportive families is that, you know, people who love you, they do to you and for you because they love you right. It's hard for people who love you to just sort of sit and be with you. And so you ladies, I hear them say you know, I feel lonely, or I feel alone even though you know I'm surrounded by people who love me. I think if your perspective is to include the family in the process, particularly children And if they're around and say, You know what, we're doing this together, then maybe you don't feel so alone in the process.

Unknown Speaker  20:06  
Yeah, it's, it's such an unusual, it's such an unusual disease well, to so many diseases or, you know, it is you are the only one that's going through the disease, you know, somebody else can have heart attack for you, right? When else cannot, you know, fix your broken bone for you. But this is just such an unusual disease, and that you really don't know what it's like, unless you have walked a mile in the shoes. And so off topic, but you know, if you can, and I benefited very much from joining a group of other women to just talk about it. I think that that is a great piece of advice there. You know, groups, social therapy groups are not for everybody. Right? And, you know, you can pop in and out, but, but boy, there's something really beneficial about having other people around that are like, yeah, yeah, I know what that's like. Yeah, that's, that was tough.

Unknown Speaker  21:03  
Yeah. Yeah. And I'm very clear to say to ladies, you know, I don't know, because I'm not going, but I'm going to tell you what other people tell me and you know, you know, take with it, take from it, what you will, but, but it is wonderful. So, are there any other messages, before we end that you might want to share with our listeners about your book or your story or communicating about a cancer diagnosis?

Unknown Speaker  21:29  
Um, you know, I just, I think this is probably my overall feeling is that it gives you an opportunity to really reevaluate life, and what is important, and at the end of the day, everything sort of really can fall away. And it comes down to your health and your happiness and your family. And, oftentimes, like sort of what I was just saying, You don't understand it until you're, you're in it. And this is one of those things where for evermore after, after this time, when you're told you have this, this diagnosis, you will come to appreciate how a lot of other things in your life just really don't matter that much like this is what really matters. So I see it as sort of a, like a, like, I was about to say palate cleanser, but you know what I mean? It's sort of like something that just makes everything really, really clear, super clear of what what's in the I care about this column? And what's in the Yeah, this doesn't bother me quite so much. And that's

Unknown Speaker  22:45  
probably where the term don't sweat, the small stuff came from,

Unknown Speaker  22:48  
right, seriously. Yeah, seriously, I

Unknown Speaker  22:50  
mean, every day is a gift for all of us. But for when you're looking at something like a cancer diagnosis.

Unknown Speaker  22:58  
And the other thing is, you know, most, most people that go through this want to figure out a way that they can, and I call it like turning my yuck into something beautiful, or, you know, do something that helps transition, what is a very difficult thing into something beautiful for somebody else. And that could be as simple as you know, volunteering to be on the other end of the phone, in your cancer center, when they're like, Hey, you know, we have people that are been newly diagnosed, would you mind just talking on the phone with them? if they have any questions? Yep, too. You know, going on some of the chat boards and some of the different online resources and just adding your two bits of what your experiences was like, or, you know, maybe it's, you know, getting involved in some local organization. You know, week I live in Marin County, which has, has the distinction of being a hotbed of, well, it used to be I think it's better now of cancer, breast cancer diagnosis. And so there are a lot of great organizations that do fundraising in the form of, you know, runs or hikes or whatever, and just going to something like that, if that feels right. And just showing up and being like, Yeah, I did this, I did this. I got through this, and just sort of being a being a survivor in the, in the most present of ways, like, Here I am, look at me. And I think that's really helpful to people who were in the midst of it, or shortly after it. I know, you know, seeing somebody that's five years out, 10 years out, 15 years out, 20 years out, 25 years out, it's like yeah, you're Yeah, I'm gonna get through this.

Unknown Speaker  24:54  
Through this. So yes, yes, absolutely. So if our listeners want to find out More about you and your book, what would be the best way for them to do that?

Unknown Speaker  25:04  
Well, I have a little website, and it's the name of the book nowhere hair.com. And it has a videos about me if anybody, I look a lot younger, because I was a lot younger. And it shows inside of the book, and it shows the cancer centers where this book is. And if you go to a cancer center, and they don't have the book, go to your kind librarian in the cancer center or talk to your, your oncologist or your social worker or your nurse. I mean, you know, everybody that's in this field is just trying to help as much as possible and, and like you said, Dr. Gold, you've got a lot on your plate as a physician, and you're talking to your patients about a lot of really important things. But they're, you know, the cancer, your cancer team is really looking out for your for what's best for you holistically, and if you can, you know, we find, yeah, find find resources like this that are helpful, it, it will help a lot of people. That's why there's Yeah, I can't even believe 20 something 1000 books out there. It's Yes, there are a lot of women and a lot of kids that needed to understand a crazy time.

Unknown Speaker  26:18  
Absolutely. What a wonderful resource. Well, thank you so much sue for sharing your story. I definitely know that it will help lots of our cancer patients who are struggling with how to talk to their kids about their illness.

Unknown Speaker  26:33  
That's great. Well, it's been a pleasure. It's been super fun to talk about this.

Unknown Speaker  26:37  
So listeners thank you so much for tuning in to the breast of everything. I'm Dr. Lindsay gold of comprehensive breast care. We want to hear from you. If you have a topic that you'd like us to talk about. We welcome your suggestions if you can send them to comp breast care. com. That's compbreastcare.com Thank you so much. Until next time,

Unknown Speaker  27:04  
you've been listening to the breast of everything podcast with your host and board certified breast surgeon, Dr. Lindsay gold of comprehensive breast care. If you have a subject you would like the surgeons to discuss, please email your suggestions online at comp breast care.com that's co MP vr EASTC a r e.com. The doctors want to hear from you. The views thoughts and opinions shared in this podcast are intended for general education and informational purposes only and should not be substituted for medical advice, treatment or care from your physician or healthcare provider. Always consult your healthcare provider first.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai